First God now the Founders ??

j.p.
Posts: 238
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:40 pm

First God now the Founders ??

Post by j.p. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:00 pm

"Under my administration, we will always defend the very first right in the Declaration of Independence and that is the right to life," Trump said from the Rose Garden, flanked by March for Life participants.
http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/19/politics/ ... index.html

Oh Gawd, the shit people make up. This is one of the reasons why we can't have an honest debate on abortion. Next thing you
know someone might claim that contraception is the taking of a life, oh wait !

I liked Trump's views before he invented the "base".

k.d.
Posts: 398
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:19 pm

Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by k.d. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:16 pm

Another gawddamn CNN link.
It is 2018 and there is still a need for abortions? How stupid is that? Evidently all that sex education isn't worth a damn.
The only people that would need an abortion are retarded sluts. Anyone who gets an abortion should be required to have their tubes tied, a clitoral circumcision and their vagina sown up and hermetically sealed.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

j.p.
Posts: 238
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:40 pm

Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by j.p. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:57 pm

k.d. wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:16 pm
Another gawddamn CNN link.
It is 2018 and there is still a need for abortions? How stupid is that? Evidently all that sex education isn't worth a damn.
The only people that would need an abortion are retarded sluts. Anyone who gets an abortion should be required to have their tubes tied, a clitoral circumcision and their vagina sown up and hermetically sealed.
Not a fan myself. So, I don't reckon I'll get one anytime soon. But what does the bible, declaration of independence and the constitution say about abortion ? nuttin right ?

k.d.
Posts: 398
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:19 pm

Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by k.d. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:54 pm

I think they all say something about life.
My belief is so simple and straight forward even a retarded slut could understand it. If something has a beating heart it is a life. if you stop that beating heart you have taken a life.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

j.p.
Posts: 238
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:40 pm

Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by j.p. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:00 pm

k.d. wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:54 pm
I think they all say something about life.
My belief is so simple and straight forward even a retarded slut could understand it. If something has a beating heart it is a life. if you stop that beating heart you have taken a life.
They mention life, yes. They don't mention abortion at all, which is kind of my point. Because folks can't argue the issue of abortion on it's own merit, they provide justifications that don't exist. In a way I don't blame them, it's a pretty complicated issue.

I don't understand the logic of using a simple heart beat from an underdeveloped heart as a marker, other than lore. It's not even the first vital organ that starts developing. I'll give you credit for not saying life begins at conception.

I don't know when life begins, so I prefer not to guess especially when it doesn't involve me. If it did involve me, I would pick a point probably earlier than yours.

k.d.
Posts: 398
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Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by k.d. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:35 pm

They don't mention abortion at all, which is kind of my point
Sure they do, but they call it murder.
Because folks can't argue the issue of abortion on it's own merit,
Let me hear you argue the merit of stopping a beating heart of an innocent living being.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

j.p.
Posts: 238
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:40 pm

Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by j.p. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 8:35 pm

k.d. wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:35 pm
They don't mention abortion at all, which is kind of my point
Sure they do, but they call it murder.
By "they" I was referring the Bible, Declaration, and Constitution. No mention of abortion that I am aware of. As an admitted literalist, I would think you could appreciate that.
Because folks can't argue the issue of abortion on it's own merit,
Let me hear you argue the merit of stopping a beating heart of an innocent living being.
Again you are changing my meaning of a word "merit" . Of course there is nothing meritorious about abortion.

I would immediately call for the arrest and prosecution of anybody taking the life of an innocent living human being.

Doesn't it creep you out a little advocating for the denial of a person 14th amendment rights

k.d.
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Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by k.d. » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:09 pm

prolicide (n.)

"killing of one's child or children," 1824, introduced by Dr. John Gordon Smith in the 2nd edition of his "Principles of Forensic Medicine;" from Latin proles "offspring" (see prolific) + -cide "a killing."

It is hoped that this word will be considered entitled to reception, on the score of analogy. We have long had parricide, fratricide, and infanticide, all (if I may use the figure of speech,) of the same family; and recently the very appropriate term foeticide has been introduced into Forensic Medicine. In both these last crimes there is a peculiarity arising from the person accused being, in almost every instance, the parent .... In this relation to the beings destroyed, the general term of murderer, or murder of offspring seems to be the fair converse of parricide; and will suit well the purpose of the Medico-legal writer, who considers the two cases as parts of one subject, for the designation of which collectively a proper term was wanting. [Smith]
abortion (n.)

1540s, "the expulsion of the fetus before it is viable," originally of deliberate as well as unintended miscarriages; from Latin abortionem (nominative abortio) "miscarriage; abortion, procuring of an untimely birth," noun of action from past participle stem of aboriri "to miscarry, be aborted, fail, disappear, pass away," a compound word used in Latin for deaths, miscarriages, sunsets, etc., which according to OED is from ab, here as "amiss" (see ab-), + stem of oriri "appear, be born, arise" (see origin).

Meaning "product of an untimely birth" is from 1630s; earlier in this sense was abortive (early 14c.). Another earlier noun in English for "miscarriage" was abort (early 15c.). In the Middle English translation of Guy de Chauliac's "Grande Chirurgie" (early 15c.) Latin aborsum is used for "stillbirth, forced abortion." Abortment is attested from c. 1600; aborsement from 1530s, both archaic. Aborticide (1875) is illogical. Compare miscarriage.

In 19c. some effort was made to distinguish abortion "expulsion of the fetus between 6 weeks and 6 months" from miscarriage (the same within 6 weeks of conception) and premature labor (delivery after 6 months but before due time). The deliberate miscarriage was criminal abortion. This broke down late 19c. as abortion came to be used principally for intentional miscarriages, probably via phrases such as procure an abortion.

Criminal abortion is premeditated or intentional abortion procured, at any of pregnancy, by artificial means, and solely for the purpose of preventing the birth of a living child : feticide. At common law the criminality depended on the abortion being caused after quickening. [Century Dictionary, 1899]

Foeticide (n.) appears 1823 as a forensic medical term for deliberate premature fatal expulsion of the fetus; also compare prolicide. Another 19c. medical term for it was embryoctony, with second element from a Latinized form of Greek kteinein "to destroy." Abortion was a taboo word for much of early 20c., disguised in print as criminal operation (U.S.) or illegal operation (U.K.), and replaced by miscarriage in film versions of novels. Abortium "hospital specializing in abortions," is from 1934, in a Soviet Union context.
It clearly was a criminal offense. If anyone in this day and age needs an abortion they are retarded.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

b.w. richardson
Posts: 62
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2017 5:40 pm

Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by b.w. richardson » Mon Jan 22, 2018 10:07 am

j.p. wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:57 pm
k.d. wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:16 pm
Another gawddamn CNN link.
It is 2018 and there is still a need for abortions? How stupid is that? Evidently all that sex education isn't worth a damn.
The only people that would need an abortion are retarded sluts. Anyone who gets an abortion should be required to have their tubes tied, a clitoral circumcision and their vagina sown up and hermetically sealed.
Not a fan myself. So, I don't reckon I'll get one anytime soon. But what does the bible, declaration of independence and the constitution say about abortion ? nuttin right ?
Let's see, well, the Bible, if you bring that in people will suggest you're trying to impose your religion on them ...

Declaration, well, how about: "certain inalienable rights, that among these are life ..."

The word "abortion" may not be in those documents, but it's specious to say they don't contain concepts that can be applied to the question.

And then there's the old joke "I don't know when life begins." You know what? I was trying to think of a way to answer that, but it doesn't deserve a response. Check with your local scientists, or at least the ones with no political agenda.

j.p.
Posts: 238
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:40 pm

Re: First God now the Founders ??

Post by j.p. » Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:22 am

b.w. richardson wrote:
Mon Jan 22, 2018 10:07 am
j.p. wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:57 pm
k.d. wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:16 pm
Another gawddamn CNN link.
It is 2018 and there is still a need for abortions? How stupid is that? Evidently all that sex education isn't worth a damn.
The only people that would need an abortion are retarded sluts. Anyone who gets an abortion should be required to have their tubes tied, a clitoral circumcision and their vagina sown up and hermetically sealed.
Not a fan myself. So, I don't reckon I'll get one anytime soon. But what does the bible, declaration of independence and the constitution say about abortion ? nuttin right ?
Let's see, well, the Bible, if you bring that in people will suggest you're trying to impose your religion on them ...

Declaration, well, how about: "certain inalienable rights, that among these are life ..."

The word "abortion" may not be in those documents, but it's specious to say they don't contain concepts that can be applied to the question.

And then there's the old joke "I don't know when life begins." You know what? I was trying to think of a way to answer that, but it doesn't deserve a response. Check with your local scientists, or at least the ones with no political agenda.
I think it would be specious to say that "certain inalienable rights" was meant to apply to anything other live human beings.

I don't think scientists are any more qualified than anybody else to declare when a life begins. I assume you would get about as many different answers as the general populace. Only God knows when life begin, and so far He hasn't let is know.

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