Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

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j.p.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#11 Post by j.p. » Wed Mar 28, 2018 9:41 pm

k.d. wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:21 pm
There is no right guaranteed in the constitution to own or posess an AR-15.
I don't see anything limiting arms to muskets.
or handgrenades

k.d.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#12 Post by k.d. » Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:12 pm

or canons
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

j.p.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#13 Post by j.p. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:30 am

k.d. wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:12 pm
or canons
Yet everybody accepts that the 2nd amendment does not guarantee the right to posses a canon.

k.d.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#14 Post by k.d. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 8:57 am

I'd have to see the court ruling on that.
The only reason I don't have a canon is because they are a pain to lug around.
You realize that when those amendments were written there was no standing army and the citizens were responsible for defending themselves and their countrymen. In the Declaration of Independence one of the complaints was that the king did not protect the people from attacks by Indian tribes. How do you suppose a frontier community protected themselves against tribal attacks? Do you think possibly they built some fortifications around them and purchased or made some sort of powerful armaments to protect themselves? It was either that or getting scalped, raped or savaged.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

j.p.
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Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:40 pm

Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#15 Post by j.p. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 10:09 am

k.d. wrote:
Thu Mar 29, 2018 8:57 am
I'd have to see the court ruling on that.
The only reason I don't have a canon is because they are a pain to lug around.
You realize that when those amendments were written there was no standing army and the citizens were responsible for defending themselves and their countrymen. In the Declaration of Independence one of the complaints was that the king did not protect the people from attacks by Indian tribes. How do you suppose a frontier community protected themselves against tribal attacks? Do you think possibly they built some fortifications around them and purchased or made some sort of powerful armaments to protect themselves? It was either that or getting scalped, raped or savaged.
Can't argue with the need for powerful armaments in times of wars as is what you describe in your parable.

Other than that, the only need for powerful weapons, such as assault rifles, is for mass murder. If you can provide another purpose for a AR-15, please post. But please do me a favor and be reasonable.

k.d.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#16 Post by k.d. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 10:29 am

I need you to be reasonable also. By your statement you are implying that only mass murders have or want AR-15s.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

j.p.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#17 Post by j.p. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:45 pm

k.d. wrote:
Thu Mar 29, 2018 10:29 am
I need you to be reasonable also. By your statement you are implying that only mass murders have or want AR-15s.
Please read it again.

I did NOT say "have". I did NOT say "want". I DID say "need". The difference is not trivial.

I totally understand the "coolness" factor to owning and shooting an AR-15. Any collector would want one. Peaceful people who frankly get a rush out of explosions and enjoy breaking things whould probably want on. I get it. But there is no practical need for them.

I have lately come to realize that our fun is not worth the carnage. There is one common denominator to all of the mass murders as of late, and that is that the perp was able to get off mutliple rounds in a very short period of time without reloading.

k.d.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#18 Post by k.d. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:57 pm

Then you agree that people who have an AR-15 or want an AR-15 DO NOT feel a NEED to commit mass murder. Finally, you are making some progress.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

j.p.
Posts: 392
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:40 pm

Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#19 Post by j.p. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 8:51 pm

k.d. wrote:
Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:57 pm
Then you agree that people who have an AR-15 or want an AR-15 DO NOT feel a NEED to commit mass murder. Finally, you are making some progress.
I would correct your statement to "not all" people. Nicolas Cruz and others sure as hell needed the AR-15 to commit mass murder. The point is that people should not be put in grave danger from wackos and evil people just so some hobbiest can get their jollies. There is no compelling reason not to ban such weapons in my opinion.

k.d.
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Re: Leave it to our last (mostly) honest president...

#20 Post by k.d. » Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:49 pm

Cruz is a terrible example simply because he should not have been on the street. Period. But, that aside, since more people are murdered by knives, fists, feet, motorized vehicles, and a multitude of other legal products,do you want those items banned also. Let's see you be rationally consistent.
“Everything government touches turns to crap.”

― Ringo Starr

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